Filters and filter holders

[Andybazyoung]

I feel it is time I investing a range of neutral density and grad filters but do not know which way to turn!
Screw on filters or filter holders!! & which filters should I get or do I need.
My main reason for filters is landscape/ sunset/ sunrise, water shots.
Any suggestions would be grateful
Andy

[Donald]

Screw on filters or filter holders!! & which filters should I get or do I need.
My main reason for filters is landscape/ sunset/ sunrise, water shots.

Andy

I'm sure there'll be a range of advice and suggestions and at the end of the day you just need to read what you can and make a decision as to what you think best suits you. Also, we don't know how deep your pocket is for this.

For my part, my responses to your questions would be:

• A filter holder system. Much more flexible and offers greater choice at better value.
• Which filters? Graduated neutral density (GND). Start with, I'd suggest,' a 3 stop GND. Next question - Do you get hard edge of soft edge? As a rule of thumb - Hard edge is best for a definite, defined horizon; e.g. seascapes. Soft edge is better for landscapes of undulating hills, with trees etc.
• If you are really in to sunsets and sunrises, then you might want to consider a Reverse GND that is darkest at the middle a tapering off to the top. But they are very specialist tools and only worth it if you know you're going to use them.
• Neutral Density - Again it's about what budget you have. The absolute gold standard is a Singh Ray Vari ND. You can adjust how much light gets in.
• Many folk doing landscapes would never go out without a circular polariser. I don't use one these days. It's about personal preference.
• In terms of brands, it is, again, influenced by how much you've got to spend. Cokin is a hugely popular, but not top[-of-the-range system. Lee is several steps up the quality (and price) ladder. And then you get to Singh Ray. There are other manufacturers, but Cokin, Lee and Singh Ray cover the marker in terms of price and quality.

Hopw this at least helps you start your journey of exploration. Final bit of advice - Don't rush into it. Take your time to learn what's out there and what your needs really are. It's very easy to make expensive mistakes.

[dje]

Hi Andy

A few more comments to supplement Donald's sound advice.

For GND's definitely go for the square filter holder rather than screw on.

I would recommend the 100mm size rather than 75mm (correction 85mm). It will cover the higher end and wider lenses better in terms of avoiding vignetting.

Another mid-range brand you might consider is Formatt - HiTech who are located in Wales.

As far as ND's are concerned, you can buy them for the square filter systems but you are probably better off using screw on for these. The filter holders can be mounted on top of screw on filters (within limits) so this will allow you to use both ND and GND together if necessary.

Dave

[Andybazyoung]

Thank you Donald, your advice is greatly appreciated.
Do the slot in or square filter holders sit on a ring that attaches to the lens which means I will have different sizes for different lenses! I have read some articles that suggest hard edge filters give best results but I suppose that is subjective & personal choice!
Andy

[Andybazyoung]

Hi Dave, sorry, can you please amplify what you mean by 100mm & 70mm filters! Does it simply mean one covers the lens much more than the other?
I do however otherwise, get what you are saying thanks
Andy

[Polar01]

Andy I am going to add a link which compares the holder systems against each other, they also sell filters as they are in the U.S. and you are in Dartmoor that is not of use to you but the chart is.

Cheers: Allan

See post #8 for the link I forgot to add it before posting.

[Andybazyoung]

Sorry Allan, can't see any link!

[Polar01]

Sorry my bad, did not add link below is the link

http://www.2filter.com/prices/gradua...20holders.html

Cheers: Allan

[dje]

Hi Dave, sorry, can you please amplify what you mean by 100mm & 70mm filters! Does it simply mean one covers the lens much more than the other?
I do however otherwise, get what you are saying thanks
Andy

Andy my choice of the word "cover" was perhaps mis-leading. I probably should have said something like "be suitable for". Also I should have said 85mm rather than 75mm. The 100mm size is somewhat larger than the common wide angle thread diameters such as 77mm or 82mm and hence this minimizes the chance of vignetting. You also get more up/down adjustment with the 100mm filter. Most of the higher quality filters are 100mm (or larger).

Is that any clearer ?

Dave

[Donald]

Do the slot in or square filter holders sit on a ring that attaches to the lens which means I will have different sizes for different lenses!

You screw a ring onto the lens and the filter holder sits on that. If you have lenses with different filter thread sizes (diameter) then the answer is a step up ring. Take my example. All my lenses, except one, have a 77mm filter size. So I bought a 77m ring onto which I slide my filter holder. But my Canon 70-200mm f/4L IS has a 67mm ring size. Answer? - A 67-77 step-up ring. I screw on the step up ring, then my 77mm filter holder ring and then the filter holder.

[jcuknz]

I think Donalds suggestion of step-up rings could be more convienient but Cokin at least and probably the other makers of holders have rings which on the front slot into the filter holder and on the rear match the lens thread.
Don't know if you normally use a lens hood but it is probable that you if you do you will also need to buy one to fit in the front slot of the holder.
When I was using thse filters I left the ring on the lens.
As to if you really need these filters does depend on if you believe in getting the result SOOC or happy to solve the problems in editing. If you want to use a polarising filter the Cokin A holder has a slot for the CPL with its own filter with knurled rim to help rotating it ...mine are rather old now and I don't know if the current model has this feature.

I thought I was being clever when I wanted to play with Infa-Red and bought a six inch square of filter material ... after cutting it into four quarters and on selling three to others wanting to play I mounted my gel in a Cokin holder .... This was a mistake and with the long IR exposures odd stray bits of light spoiled shots and the problem wasn't solved until I further cut down my filter gel to match a clear filter and made it light tight around the edges. So I suggest biting the bullet and picking a lens for your IR work and buying a IR filter for that lens.
The fogging could possible occur with very long exposures with regular filters unless precautions are taken ... the holders have lots of holes in them.
That's my tuppence, and some, on the subject

[NigelD]

As you're in the UK, another Company you might consider is Hitech. They make the same range as Lee filters but are more affordable. Take a look at http://www.teamworkphoto.com/ who I have used a number of times in the past - they're really helpful.

[Andybazyoung]

Thanks Allan

[Andybazyoung]

This makes sense to me Dave, much clearer thanks

[Andybazyoung]

I have a Canon 50mm, a 70 - 200mm f/1.4L IS & Canon EFS 17 - 85mm lenses both of which are 67mm ring sizes.
Is there a step up ring to fit the above lenses?
Everything has now fitted into place thanks very much.
Iv'e looked at your images on the website; do you use filters much to get the great results you have selected?

[Tringa]

I can't add much to the advice above except to say from my limited experience (I have only used hard grad filters) I think hard grads are potentially more useful.

I don't have an FF camera so this may have an effect, but when I look through the viewfinder and lower the hard grad into place the dividing line between dark and light is not really 'hard' at all; it was more gradual than I expected. I would guess, though others with a working knowledge of soft grads would know better, that soft grads will only be really dark at the top. They therefore may not give the reduction in light that is needed though I can see where the horizon is broken by hills, trees or in any other way a soft grad may be useful.

If you have not already bought filter kit yet, Andy have a look at this site http://srb-photographic.co.uk/

Dave

[Andybazyoung]

Thanks Dave,
It's a bit like Christmas everything coming at once!! Nonetheless great everyone & thank you so much for advice given
Andy

[jcuknz]

For a UK based person you could try SRB-Griturn.com for the step rings, up and down, and lots of other related products.
How hard the edge would depend on the depth of field at the time of use and the focusing point.The closer the near limit of DoF to the filter the sharper it will appear to be.