7d ii

[loosecanon]

Must admit I would like better low light performance than my 7D, but buying a 10-18 stablised lens has helped here. Like the idea of inbuilt GPS, but will worry about effect on battery life. Like the standardisation of the controls with 5D3. Maybe when the price is right, or maybe I should buy a 70D and have a lighter camera, if only it had the new 7D2 focus point selection.
Conclusion - will wait a year and see what price they are.

[Black Pearl]

One thing to note is you only get 10fps if you're shooting at 1/1000s or faster and the lens must be wide open....which is a bit weird.

[ajohnw]

I found a canon site spec the other day that had all sorts of qualifiers on ISO ratings when flash is used but can't find it again. Also metering only down to 1 EV. This one states 0 EV but that still doesn't match the focusing. This doesn't seem to be unusual though.

http://www.canon.co.uk/For_Home/Prod...fications.html

It's bigger and heavier than the 6D thanks to the must be metal 19th century fanatics Your all mad. It also may cost more than the 6D and is unlikely to have as good noise figures. i wonder what a 6D II would offer but suspect that would impact too much on the higher end cameras if they offered the same.

The idea of being able to use a small block of AF sensors in the centre of the frame sounds good to me not the shear number of them.

John
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[DanK]

John,

I don't think a comparison to the 6D is terribly useful. The 6D and 7DII are designed for very different uses. The 6D gives very good sensor performance at a low cost, obtained by giving up a lot of other things, like a strong AF system. The 7DII is designed for people whose photography benefits from precisely what the 6D lacks, such as reach and AF. I think there are three particularly useful comparisons:

-- 7DII vs. 7D: how much has changed/improved?
-- 7DII vs. 5DIII. The 5DIII overlaps a lot with the 7DII in features, so this is a reasonable comparison for people who want those features and are trying to decide between formats.
-- 7DII vs. Nikon 7100: for people who want to compare the most similar models by the two manufacturers.

Dan

[mknittle]

Well the 7D prices will be pretty good for people on a budget looking for a very nice camera.

[ajohnw]

Can't agree with that Dan. The 6D also has the same style low light sensitive AF but less points. It's ISO noise performance is very likely to be better and many do manage to crop APS sized shots out of FF. The only problem really with full frame is that it needs more magnification to make use of the extra resolution. Sometimes that is a problem, sometimes it's not.

John
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[Black Pearl]

The biggest complaint from users and reviewers of the 6D is the AF system which is a bit grim - though to be fair it doesn't need to be great because the camera is aimed at landscape/portrait shooters who don't need a better one. But even then it has a measly level focus points with only one of them being a cross type which is primitive in the extreme. The system in the 7D MkII is a completely different beast designed for action/wildlife etc.

[ajohnw]

It might turn into a D600 Robin as you suggested however on the 6D

Focus acquisition on the EOS 6D displays all the hallmarks of mature phase detection AF performance. The camera is quick to lock focus and under most conditions does so with a high degree of accuracy. In reviewing hundreds of images shot with the 6D, the vast majority of shots that did lack critical sharpness were due to either subject or camera movement. Photographing active children indoors will be a challenge, but you will come away with keepers - if you keep your subjects largely in the middle of the frame.

The area where the 6D really shines, however, is in acquiring focus consistently in very low-light conditions. Canon has rated the center AF point's sensitivity at -3 EV, one stop lower than any full frame DSLR on the market. And our real world use with the camera bears out this impressive performance.

4 stops better than the D600.

It is limited on burst rate but having a camera that will even hold a high one I wonder about that and what the 7D II can do may only become clear when the full reviews are out.. My problem in this sort of area is that numbers in a sense are irrelevent except when the infringe on practicalities - such as low light or not but the 7D II looks like it answers that.. I expect most things I shoot especially sport to be in the centre of the frame - just like the many shots Bill (WM) posts. In fact a camera focusing on the incorrect AF point is a pain. Basically I don't get sucked in by advertising numbers - practicalities are what really count. No point in having loads of AF points if the majority get turned off most of the time. The 7D II's central block is probably an improvement.

John
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[Black Pearl]

When you've actually used one and A. tried to get it to focus off centre having selected one of the none cross sensor AF points and B. tried to get it to acquire and track a fast moving subject then please come back and I may pay attention. Mind you you might want to also try it up against a camera with a really good AF sensor at the same time to give yourself some idea of what can be achieved.

By the way I didn't mentioned the D600 or even mentioned Nikon at all but as you found the need to then that body has a less than fantastic AF sensor too. You need to go to their pro bodies (or weirdly the D7100) to get their properly good 51 system.

[JR1]

When you've actually used one and A. tried to get it to focus off centre having selected one of the none cross sensor AF points and B. tried to get it to acquire and track a fast moving subject then please come back and I may pay attention. Mind you you might want to also try it up against a camera with a really good AF sensor at the same time to give yourself some idea of what can be achieved.

By the way I didn't mentioned the D600 or even mentioned Nikon at all but as you found the need to then that body has a less than fantastic AF sensor too. You need to go to their pro bodies (or weirdly the D7100) to get their properly good 51 system.

Ill stay with the Nikon D7100 (and D4s)

[TGCorneliussen]

On paper would the 7D II be a gd option or too spend the little extra on a 5d III?

[FootLoose]

I think that depends on what you want it for, TGC.

If the 7D II is as good as the hype, then I suspect the 5D III must be due for an similar upgrade, too. There looks to be only about $500 difference between the two here.

[DanK]

I think that depends on what you want it for, TGC.

If the 7D II is as good as the hype, then I suspect the 5D III must be due for an similar upgrade, too. There looks to be only about $500 difference between the two here.

Not in the US. At a reputable discounter, the 7D is $1,000, the 7D2 is $1800, and the 5D3 is $3200 with a temporary rebate, 3400 after Sept 27. I suspect much of this is the much higher fabrication cost of the larger sensor, since the features are otherwise fairly similar.

[TGCorneliussen]

Norway abt 3800 usd for 5D III

[Black Pearl]

According to Canon's sensor white paper, a FF sensor costs 20 times an APS-C sensor.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...75097201,d.ZWU

This is due to several factors:

1. Area of sensor, so the number of sensors manufactured per 8-inch wafer. This alone means only 1/10th the number of FF sensors can be made per wafer as APS-C sensors.

2. For a given number of contaminant particles on a wafer, a larger percentage of FF sensors will fail - 10 widely space dust specs will damage 10 of the 200 APS-C sensors on a wafer - 190 good sensors remain (95% or a loss of only 5%). However those same 10 dust specs will damage 10 of the 20 FF sensors on a wafer, a loss of 50%.

2. FF sensors require triple the number of photo-lithography steps, meaning they're slower and more costly to make.

According to Canon the total of these factors results in a 20x price difference.


Might be true might have some half truths not sure but it makes sense in the most part.

[Glenn NK]

According to Canon's sensor white paper, a FF sensor costs 20 times an APS-C sensor.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...75097201,d.ZWU

This is due to several factors:

1. Area of sensor, so the number of sensors manufactured per 8-inch wafer. This alone means only 1/10th the number of FF sensors can be made per wafer as APS-C sensors.

2. For a given number of contaminant particles on a wafer, a larger percentage of FF sensors will fail - 10 widely space dust specs will damage 10 of the 200 APS-C sensors on a wafer - 190 good sensors remain (95% or a loss of only 5%). However those same 10 dust specs will damage 10 of the 20 FF sensors on a wafer, a loss of 50%.

2. FF sensors require triple the number of photo-lithography steps, meaning they're slower and more costly to make.

According to Canon the total of these factors results in a 20x price difference.


Might be true might have some half truths not sure but it makes sense in the most part.

As you say, it's hard to know the actual numbers, but we do know FF sensors are more expensive to make.

Fortunately the difference between crop and FF bodies doesn't vary as much.

In any event, this new 7DII will have a few buyers. The 20 MP sensor would provide a (20/8.1) ^1/2 = 1.57 increase in resolution improvement over my 30D.

There are quite a number of wildlife/birders in general that will welcome this body, and the price is very attractive too.

Glenn

[Black Pearl]

The birders will (should, they're a funny lot) love it if that AF chip and frame rate live up to the hype. The 7D was and still is a solid performer with this looking to be being a worth while successor.

[rpcrowe]

Many of the "REVIEWS" that are mentioned and/or quoted are, IMO, not really reviews but simply rehashes of the manufacturer's specifications and, sometimes, the opinion of the "REVIEWER" as to how well he/she likes those specifications.

[ajohnw]

Many of the "REVIEWS" that are mentioned and/or quoted are, IMO, not really reviews but simply rehashes of the manufacturer's specifications and, sometimes, the opinion of the "REVIEWER" as to how well he/she likes those specifications.

The one I posted was a preview. They will do a review later.

John
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[chauncey]

This one isn't bad...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fSk2_-FRgpo for a hands-on thing.