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Thread: Canon 430 vs 580 vs radio triggers Santa letter needs help

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    speedneeder's Avatar
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    Canon 430 vs 580 vs radio triggers Santa letter needs help

    I own a 430ex II, three YN-560, and an rf602 (using a 60D).

    Questions:
    If I buy another 430 can I control different zones with my 60D as a commander?
    If I buy a 580 can I control different zones with my 60D?
    Do I need a pocket wizard or st-e2 to control different zones in ETTL?
    Do only pocket wizards support HSS with radio triggers?
    Do only pocket wizards support ETTL or ETTL 2?

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    Re: Canon 430 vs 580 vs radio triggers Santa letter needs help

    Hi Brian,

    1. No idea, sorry.

    2. Using the 580EX as a master controller on the camera, yes - otherwise, as per (1) above

    3. With PocketWizards, the zones are set on the TT5, not the flash - so assuming you have a TT1 on camera, yes you can control different zones from the camera. In terms of the ST-E2 - just trust me on this one - "don't go there".

    4. No - the ST-E2 does, a 580 as master controller does, and technically the RadioPorrers do too, but you need an ST-E2 for them to work (or some other transmitter)

    5. Aside from the Canon products already mentioned, and RadioPoppers already mentioned, there are cheaper 3rd party solution (Mark mentioned one the other day, but I don't recall the brand name), but my (strong) caution would be that you're likely to find that you're going to hit the wall eventually with some of these "solutions", and they'll end up costing you more in the long run. My advice is to bite the bullet and get PocketWizards, and stick to Canon flashes (because PW explicetly say that - although clone flashes may (or may not) work, none-the-less, they don't support them).

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    Re: Canon 430 vs 580 vs radio triggers Santa letter needs help

    Quote Originally Posted by speedneeder View Post
    I own a 430ex II, three YN-560, and an rf602 (using a 60D).

    Questions:
    If I buy another 430 can I control different zones with my 60D as a commander?
    If I buy a 580 can I control different zones with my 60D?
    Do I need a pocket wizard or st-e2 to control different zones in ETTL?
    Do only pocket wizards support HSS with radio triggers?
    Do only pocket wizards support ETTL or ETTL 2?
    I recently bought a Phottix odin transmitter and 2 receivers. Full ETTL, HSS, 2nd curtain, 3 zone control etc, etc

    http://www.phottix.com/en/phottix-od...for-canon.html

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    Mark von Kanel's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 430 vs 580 vs radio triggers Santa letter needs help

    Hi mark,

    how are you getting on with the odin? Keep us informed please as i will be investing in triggers within the next six months or so and these look like an alternative to the very expensive PW's

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    Re: Canon 430 vs 580 vs radio triggers Santa letter needs help

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark von Kanel View Post
    Hi mark,

    how are you getting on with the odin? Keep us informed please as i will be investing in triggers within the next six months or so and these look like an alternative to the very expensive PW's
    So far excellent. Not one misfire!!!! Everything works as stated.

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    speedneeder's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 430 vs 580 vs radio triggers Santa letter needs help

    Thanks for the comments and suggestions.
    I have looked into radio TTL triggers before and I always end up confused.
    TT1/TT5 is different that Plus II's? Does mini make any difference?
    I looked up some pricing and it doesn't seem that the Phottix units are THAT much cheaper than the PW's. They are both imperfect solutions but PW's certainly have a much longer track record. So if they are the only option for wireless TTL/HSS then I think that is the direction I would go... BUT wow, I still get hung up on the price.
    I'm thinking if I bought a 580ex II and the necessary PW parts just to run the 580 and the 430, I would spend ~$1,000! I might be able to stomach that if I can still use my YN-560's for some .... I think 'rim' lighting would be the correct term.
    I know all this info is out there be read SOMEWHERE, but if anyone would like to comment further, I would appreciate any info and suggestions.
    Thanks

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    Re: Canon 430 vs 580 vs radio triggers Santa letter needs help

    Hi Brian,

    Quote Originally Posted by speedneeder View Post
    TT1/TT5 is different that Plus II's?
    Plus II's are older units. They had greater range, but they only do basic triggering (ie no ETTL). The TT1 / TT5 units can still trigger a Plus II though.

    Does mini make any difference?
    If you're meaning "Mini TT1" then no - one and the same (the TT5 is also known as the Flex TT5)

    I looked up some pricing and it doesn't seem that the Phottix units are THAT much cheaper than the PW's. They are both imperfect solutions but PW's certainly have a much longer track record. So if they are the only option for wireless TTL/HSS then I think that is the direction I would go... BUT wow, I still get hung up on the price.
    PocketWizards & Phottix both do ETTL / HSS, but I don't think that the Phottix will do things like Hypersync, SpeedCycler, Profiles, Preflash Boost, Camera-mounted flash. Also, not sure if the Phottix will switch the flashes to HSS mode automatically when required (I read that they have a button for doing this).

    I'm thinking if I bought a 580ex II and the necessary PW parts just to run the 580 and the 430, I would spend ~$1,000! I might be able to stomach that if I can still use my YN-560's for some .... I think 'rim' lighting would be the correct term.
    I know all this info is out there be read SOMEWHERE, but if anyone would like to comment further, I would appreciate any info and suggestions.
    Thanks
    You could still use the YN-560's in manual mode, but you'd still need a way of triggering them.

    I'm afraid that flash gear is one of the areas where trying to do it on the cheap usually ends up costing more in the long run. If you think $1000 is bad, give a thought to what 4x 580EX II + 4x CP-E4 + 4x TT5 + 1x TT1 + 4-Square + extras all cost me! (but I wouldn't trade it for anything elese, and would do it the same way again in a heart beat!).

    On a side note, if you do go the TT1 / TT5 route, (a) be sure to get an AC3 zone controller (bliss!), and (b) I can set them up for you and eMail you the profiles.
    Last edited by Colin Southern; 1st November 2011 at 09:06 PM.

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    speedneeder's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 430 vs 580 vs radio triggers Santa letter needs help

    Great, now I need a zone controller too?!
    What does that do for me?

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    Re: Canon 430 vs 580 vs radio triggers Santa letter needs help

    Quote Originally Posted by speedneeder View Post
    Great, now I need a zone controller too?!
    What does that do for me?
    Don't panic - they're not expensive

    They allow you to control up to 3 zones with the flick of a switch. For each zone theres a switch that sets the zone to either off - manual - or automatic. There's also a thumbwheel for each zone; in manual mode it sets power output (with +3 being a full dump), all the way down to -3 which is 1/64th (in 1/3 increments). In Automatic mode (thing ETTL) it controls flash compensation +/- 3 stops (in 1/3 increments).

    It's one of my favourite pieces of kit. As luck would have it, I turned up to a commercial location shoot the other day - assembled my gear - and realised that I'd left the AC3 at home. I actually had to start thinking again; it wasn't a pretty sight!

    PS: While I think of it, even manual control of speedlights by PocketWizards is done with the speedlight in ETTL mode (although you can have them in manual mode, but then you'd have to set the power manually) (and set the TT5 for basic triggering).

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