Shooting wedding dresses - need help

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Originally Posted by jiro

I think this has been the norm nowadays. Killing the ambient light by 1 - 1.5 stops and then light the subject with the flash and some kickers.

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I don't know about "kickers" (I use them, but I wouldn't call them the norm per se) ... the problem is though - with the kind of light Bud is describing - one has to either make the choice to either use it to illuminate the subjects (at which point of the day it's going to be VERY warm quite quickly (and before too long, weak, where shutterspeeds will drop to 1/20th or less at 1600 ISO @ any F-Stop respectable enough to retain a decent D of F (say F5.6)) -- or to put it behind them, in which case one has to compete against it (unless one wants silhouettes).

Competing against the light makes for great shots, but one needs the lighting rig(s) to be able to produce quality light ...

I'll give you some examples ...

This was shot about 1/2 hour (or slightly more) before sunset, using a couple of gelled 580EX IIs into a shoot-through umbrella ...

http://www.pbase.com/cjsouthern/imag...5/original.jpg

This was shot (about 1/2 hour after sunset) with 2x gelled 580EX II into a shoot-through unbrella, with a 3rd gelled 580EX II providing a bit of fill from camera right ...

http://www.pbase.com/cjsouthern/imag...8/original.jpg

This one was shot after sunset with 2x Naked gelled 580EX IIs - it's and "ok" shot for what it is, but not the kind of thing that's particularly flattering to a model in a wedding dress ... and Bud is only going to have - perhaps - 1/4 of the lighting power I've had available here. I think I'd be inclined to try to start the shoot a little earlier to have a better quality of natural light, and cooler temperatures, and shoot from a tripod if one is going to use the (non-IS) EF 24-70/2.8: USM - trying to illuminate a full wedding dress with a single 430EX II as the light drops is likely to be "lambs to the slaughter" I'm afraid :(


http://www.pbase.com/cjsouthern/imag...2/original.jpg

You guys are terrific and I really appreciate all the sage advice and the examples you've displayed.

I did a dry run last night with my wife (dressed in white) and confirmed all the cautions you've voiced. I could probably pull it off if I only had one gown to shoot but there are four plus two of the models will have a male escort photographed with them. I only have about 12 minutes of usable light just before sunset. The light is too harsh before and it's too dark after. The logistics of moving all the models into the backdrop area and getting them posed is too hard.

I am going to move it inside the officer's club as Jiro suggested and shoot in a controlled environment where timing is not critical. I will rent the necessary lighting equipment. Hopefully, they will have a dark backdrop I can use as well. The photos will not be as artistic, but they will be usable for publication. Wish me luck!

Hi Bud,

If you haven't seen this already, you might find some value in my "Introduction to Studio Lighting" lesson.

If the two locations (the original and the officer's club) are nearby it might be nice to get a few in the natural light and shoot the remainder inside, although, I am sure whoever gets the outside treatment will feel privileged over the other group.

http://i56.tinypic.com/2uxuutg.jpg
Now I know why I do not want to be a wedding photographer! I'm posting one of the photos so you'll know how things turned out and to let you all know how much I appreciated your help. It would have been a train wreck without your words of guidance.

The location was chosen by the Executive Director. I used my Canon 7D with a rented EF24-70 f/2.8L USM - ISO 200, 54mm, 0 EV, f/8, 1/80. In retrospect I see I should have bracketed at least 1/3; maybe 2/3. I used (with umbrella diffusers) a Speedlite 580EXII as main and my Speedlite 430EXII as fill. I should probably have used another for back light but that's all I had.

The dress is a bit blown out :( but acceptable for the purpose. Your comments are invited, but be kind. :) The charity is very excited with the results so I guess I'm satisfied..........

http://i53.tinypic.com/25kle7o.jpg
Here's a little better one of the dress not so blown out. It's a little bit better pose and although the gown is cut off slightly at the bottom, this is the one they will be using. Ok, I'm done..........

That was fast. I thought you were still testing your gears, Bud. Hehehe. I'm glad the "client" was happy with the results and that is very important. There are a lot of stuff that did not help you get the best result from the setup but it's a good thing because you'll learn a lot from this experience.

If I may comment, Bud:

1. Yeah, the dress is blown out. I'd say your shutter speed was a bit slow causing the ambient light to dominate the scene. I was thinking of using 1/125 to kill it more so the busy background would be darkened. The plants and the roof on the left of the frame did not help at all hence the idea to darken them all out by making the shutter speed faster. I did not notice the flash output at all from the shot. I'm guessing all the lights are coming from the sun on the right. This is the reason why I recommended a faster shutter speed to power down the sun's output on the shot.

2. The sailor is too tall making him dominant on the shot. The bride and the dress is the main subject here so for me the "better" option would be to put the bride near the camera in full frame from head to toe then put the sailor about 8 -10 feet away as a secondary subject. he will still help the shot composition wise but he'll not dominate the scene. I'd go for about f/8 or f/11 so he's not going to be totally blurred on the background. The stairs did not help at all and only further increased the height difference between the two.

What I'm very happy about the shot is that you were able to connect with them and that is very, very important with people photography. The smile you got looks so natural and I have to commend you on that. I'm pretty sure you're going to be far better next time because you have learned a lot from this first experience. Congrats, Bud. Yoohoo! :)

Oooopps, you posted another image. That is definitely better on the exposure side. Nice! :)

Hi Bud,

Did you shoot these RAW?

Colin/Jiro:
Yes, I shot in RAW (always do) and did some PP in Aperture 3. Didn't have to do too much other than crop, add a little definition, upped saturation a bit and fixed a hot spot in back left corner. It was shot in the shade with ambient light and the 580/430's with diffusers. I wish I taken the time to up the shutter speed and work on DOF to blur the background more.

This was my first shoot on this side of the camera. In addition to the executive director, her assistant, and four models, I had high trade winds blowing and people entering/leaving the O'club walking through the scene.

Jiro is totally right. It was a great learning experience. If I ever do something like this again I will spend more time on exposure. I was so concerned about lighting and focus, I forgot all else. I blew up test images on the LCD while shooting but my near vision isn't great and most of the shots looked OK there. When I got them up on the 27" iMac I could see the problems. Oh well, live and learn. Thank you guys again.

You'll go a long way on your photography journey, Bud because you have a great attitude in learning. From what I have realized, I have learned more about photography from my mistakes than anything else. :)

Here's one possible edit on the second image you posted.

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6187/...586d32b5_b.jpg

Thanks, you're right. The learning is the exciting part. It's something new every day. It's a great way to keep your mind agile as you grow older. Photography, like golf, is something you can do until late in life and you'll never perfect it and never know it all. It's all about the journey - not the destination.

I like the adjustments to the picture. You warmed the skin tones a bit and toned down the white while bringing up the color in the dress. Photoshop?

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Originally Posted by kaneohebud

I like the adjustments to the picture. You warmed the skin tones a bit and toned down the white while bringing up the color in the dress. Photoshop?

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Yes, all was done inside photoshop. Warmer skin tone looks great and the eyes seem to prefer it more. Post-processing can help you "rescue" some of your shots and I'm glad when you said that you always shoot in RAW. :)

Hi Bud,

I thought I'd throw a quick edit in for "good luck" too -- there seemed to be a bit of a blue cast to the others, so I've nulled that - applied a vignette to make the couple pop, and applied a bit of sharpening ...

http://i56.tinypic.com/2uzt3mg.jpg

PS: The reason I asked about shooting RAW was because it may be possible to recover more dress detail from the blown areas -- just let me know if you'd like me to take a look at it.

Sure! All instruction/help is deeply appreciated. Have a go at it. Do I need to send you the RAW and how do I do that given CiC size limitations.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kaneohebud

Sure! All instruction/help is deeply appreciated. Have a go at it. Do I need to send you the RAW and how do I do that given CiC size limitations.

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Hi Bud,

Is it under 25MB?

Yes. It's 21.3mb.