Too Many Choices. What to do?

[skilsaw]

I've been feeling G.A.S. recently and considering a 5DIII along with superzoom for photographing rugby.
Not that it will make me a better photographer, but I'll be keeping up with the Jone's on the sidelines of the pitch.
Still a lot I can learn using my 7D and 70 - 200mm. I would feel some guilt if I chose this option.

I support my sons all I can and have on occasion gone over the top in sporting gear for son #1, and musical instruments for the second son. My second son, who played guitar in a jazz band 10 years ago, has rekindled his interest in playing guitar. I have found a beautiful instrument on the internet that costs about the same as a 5DIII and a superzoom. I almost sprung for it, but have decided to start him again in lessons, and reconsider the new guitar if he finds a jazz band to sit in with. I want to encourage him in his music, but don't want to spend my money too soon if this interest doesn't last.

My third choice involves aquiring a suitable car for close friend and his wife. He is in a wheelchair so suitable vehicles are few and far between as well as relatively expensive. Unfortunately the car they did have got totaled in an accident a month ago. They are unable to come up with the cost of another vehicle. My altruistic gene is telling me to give them the cash they need to replace the car totaled in the accident.

OH, the 5DIII and superzoom lens sounds nice.

[tbob]

Tongue in cheek solution to your problem (Altruism versus Self interest)

Get the new lens and camera then sell the resulting brilliant (I assume) images to the players and their parents. Use the money to fund options two and three. The pictures should sell like hotcakes if you appeal to the vanity and pride of the parents (You don't want a picture of XXX scoring a try? I guess you don't love him/her very much.)

[DanK]

I can't speak to the tradeoffs between cars, musical instruments, and cameras, but as someone who owns a 5D3, I can talk about that vs. your 7D. Don't get me wrong: I've had my 5d3 for a year, and I am still blown away by it. It is a wonderful camera. But if I had a 7D and shot rugby, I wouldn't buy one. I'd rather have the 7D, or perhaps a 7DII, for the greater reach. People don't (usually) play rugby in the dark, so you won't benefit from the better high-ISO performance of the 5D. The 5D3 has a better AF system than the 7D, but the 7D's is very good, and from all reports, the system in the 7DII is even better than that in the 5D3.

What do you mean by "superzoom?" Usually, people don't use that term to mean "a very long zoom lens". Usually, the use it to mean "a zoom lens with a very large zoom ratio." Most lenses with very large zoom ratios are optically inferior to a lens like most of the Canon 70-200 variants, so putting one on a 5D3 would probably leave you with images at best as good as those you already get.

I think if I were in your shoes, I would think about adding one longer zoom and call it a day.

Just my two cents.

[rpcrowe]

If it were my choice, I would purchase a second 7D body (refurbished) and a 300mm f/4L IS lens plus a monopod. That would be a great combination for just about any field sports and would not require you to sell your soul to purchase the extra camera and lens. If you bought a 5Diii; keep the 7D and shoot with the 70-200mm on the full frame when things get close and use the 300mm on the 7D for distant shots.

Lots of folks will say that you absolutely need an f/2.8 lens for sports but, the (relatively) small 300mm f/4L IS on the 7D can do a darn good job of separating the subject from the background and it is a LOT lighter in weight and a LOT less expensive. I purchased mine used from a local photographer for less than $900 (USD). I shot this with my 7D and a 300mm f/4L IS lens wide open. ISO 200 and shutter speed of 1/2,500 second...



The 300mm is pretty darn nice for other types of shooting besides sports... (You didn't really think I could post without a dog image or two)

[skilsaw]

Thanks for your feedback and suggestions.
Richard, the polo picture is outstanding. Getting an action shot that sharp is a real talent.
Your dog pictures are nice too.
I assume you are into post processing and shooting raw.

I guess if I want to grow or progress in photography I will have to go that way.

[IzzieK]

David...buy the gear you wanted and take care of the guilt later on. I like the advice of Trevor...if you can make money with your gear then the rest can wait.

Hope this doesn't make me feel heartless...sometimes or many times I wanted something and "sacrificed" not having it at the time I can afford it because something got in the way and regretted it later on because while others joyfully went on their way with what I had given, I was left askance as to why I have to do it or other guilt trip feelings resultance of my decision ...

[AB26]

David,

If he is a real friend, you will know what to do.
You know what a friend is: “He who can keep your secrets”. Precious!
“A friend in need is a friend indeed”. Are you really his FRIEND?

[DanK]

I assume you are into post processing and shooting raw.

I guess if I want to grow or progress in photography I will have to go that way.

The impact on image quality of knowing how to postprocess is immeasurably larger than the difference between a 7D and a 5D3. Someone with even moderate postprocessing skills and a 7D will run circles around someone with a 5D3 who doesn't know how to postprocess.

[AB26]

The impact on image quality of knowing how to postprocess is immeasurably larger than the difference between a 7D and a 5D3. Someone with even moderate postprocessing skills and a 7D will run circles around someone with a 5D3 who doesn't know how to postprocess.

There seems to be a rather interesting move coming from the big boys in camera manufacturing, Canon and Nikon.
If you are a skilled Jpeg shooter you will have greater advantage than the shoot RAW and fix it in PP shooter.

I think the days of PP, spending time in front of the computer to fix images, is drawing to a close. It is getting better and better SOOC.

Of cause the RAW data will be there for those whom need to use it for whatever specific purpose.

[DanK]

There seems to be a rather interesting move coming from the big boys in camera manufacturing, Canon and Nikon.
If you are a skilled Jpeg shooter you will have greater advantage than the shoot RAW and fix it in PP shooter.

I think the days of PP, spending time in front of the computer to fix images, is drawing to a close. It is getting better and better SOOC.

Of cause the RAW data will be there for those whom need to use it for whatever specific purpose.

Andre, I didn't mention the raw vs. jpeg argument in my post. Jpegs can be postprocessed too, just not as well. But that isn't why I am replying. I am replying because it seems as though the OP may be relatively new to this and may be misled by your response. So, let me be more precise:

I own two bodies, a 50D, which is inferior in many respects to the OP's 7D, and a 5D Mark III. Under many conditions, photos taken with the two will be virtually indistinguishable from each other if posted on the web, and often even if printed at 8 x 10 (roughly A4). In contrast, the differences between the images from either camera before and after postprocessing are often huge. That was the point of my posting.

Re the more general question David posted, which is whether he should learn postprocessing: every serious photographer I know (I don't really know Andre), whether serious amateur or professional, devotes serious effort to postprocessing. The people who take jpegs straight out of the camera are relying on postprocessing as well; they just don't exert much control over it. As an experiment, take the same picture with your 7D several times, changing picture styles. The results will be very different. That's because each style imposes a different set of postprocessing algorithms, for sharpening, contrast, color balance, saturation, etc. These are fixed in the firmware and are applied blindly, with no response to the specifics of the image. When you learn to postprocess, you take control over those decisions yourself, and you can tailor the mix to the specifics of the particular image. To take a simple example, the lighting of a scene, as it happens to be at the time, may have too little tonal range, giving you a flat, low-contrast image. If you want more contrast, you can't fix this by 'getting it right in camera,' unless you have supernatural connections. In postprocessing, it is trivial to fix.

This is not to say that skill in handling the camera is unimportant. Just the opposite. Whatever skills Andre is calling "skilled jpeg shooter" I would call "good control of the camera." You need that regardless of the format you shoot. Postprocessing shouldn't be treated as a substitute for good control of the camera; it is an essential complement to it.

[chauncey]

David, a couple of points from one that has raise nine kids...they are fickled, what interests them today
likely will be absent from their memory tomorrow. Go easy on the current whims of a child because
they do have an underdeveloped prefrontal cortex and therefore, lack any degree of sanity.
T'was more than once that I threatened to bury one in the backyard...they laughed.

Recouping gear costs from potential future sales is an exercise in abject futility...won't happen.

Your friends...why/how did they find themselves in those circumstances? No insurance?

Read my signature and choose wisely my friend.

[Glenn NK]

Thanks for the post Wm C.

Well put.

I read an interesting article in a science-oriented magazine lately: In essence it said that "maturity in making good decisions isn't fully developed until about the age of 25."

Glenn

[chauncey]

Glenn, yeah that's what they say but...why, pray tell, did it take me until sixty.

[HaseebM]

This time round, listen to what your heart says.

[rpcrowe]

This post is really about several entirely different choices...

Whether to purchase the guitar for your son...

Whether to purchase the car for your friends...

Whether to purchase a camera/lens for yourself...

If you decide to purchase the camera/lens, they you are faced with the choices of which camera and which lens...

You mention a "super-zoom" but, did not define what a "super-zoom" means to you. What comes to my mind when I hear the term "super-zoom" is a lens with a "super" focal range such as the Canon 28-300mm or Canon 35-350mm, neither of which is particularly good as a sports lens or a lens like the Sigma 50-500mm which again is not a top sports lens. The other lenses commonly thought of as Super Zooms are for crop cameras and are really not considered practical for fast moving sports.

IMO, the absolute ideal sports combination is a pair of late model Canon 1D cameras or even a pair of 5Diii cameras with a 70-200mm f/2.8L IS and a 400mm f/2.8 lens... That combination is drastically expensive and IMO cannot be justified unless you are either shooting professionally or independently wealthy.

What you "could do" is purchase a used 300mm f/4L (IS or Non-IS) for around $700 (non-IS) to $900 (IS model) and shoot with your 7D. You then use the additional money you "saved" by not buying the 5Diii and super-zoom to help your friend get transportation...

[skilsaw]

David, Your friends...why/how did they find themselves in those circumstances? No insurance?

My friends drove an older automobile that met their needs. The wife was able to fold the wheelchair and lift it into the trunk ("boot" in the UK) They had it for years, and it served them well. The insurance companies replacement cost was very low and buying cars under a couple thousand dollars is a risk. An extra $10,000 would enable them to choose something 5 or 6 years old that has a good reputation for maintenance.

I'm beginning to wonder "Where are their sons in this situation?" My guess is they are slaves to their mortgages.

I found a local music school with a big jazz program, while my son found a teacher who he will eclipse in 6 months or less. I'm going with the teacher he found because I feel it is important for the decision to be his. The Jazz guitar can wait.


As for buying a 5DIII for photographing rugby... I'll carry on with the 7D for the time being.

Who knows. I may still have my money in my pocket come January.

[skilsaw]

David, Your friends...why/how did they find themselves in those circumstances? No insurance?

My friends drove an older automobile that met their needs. The wife was able to fold the wheelchair and lift it into the trunk ("boot" in the UK) They had it for years, and it served them well. The insurance companies replacement cost was very low and buying cars under a couple thousand dollars is a risk. An extra $10,000 would enable them to choose something 5 or 6 years old that has a good reputation for maintenance.

I'm beginning to wonder "Where are their sons in this situation?" My guess is they are slaves to their mortgages.

I found a local music school with a big jazz program, while my son found a teacher who he will eclipse in 6 months or less. I'm going with the teacher he found because I feel it is important for the decision to be his. The Jazz guitar can wait.


As for buying a 5DIII for photographing rugby... I'll carry on with the 7D for the time being.

Who knows. I may still have my money in my pocket come January.

[IzzieK]

... I'll carry on with the 7D for the time being.

Who knows. I may still have my money in my pocket come January.

Don't bet on it! (Based on countless experience) money has a way of getting spend especially if you talk about having it "for the time being..." I had began to think it has a life of its own...

[skilsaw]

David, a couple of points from one that has raise nine kids...they are fickled, what interests them today likely will be absent from their memory tomorrow.

Chauncey, You are so right! We have been there before, but I keep hoping "This time will be different."
Isn't that insanity? Believing if we do the same thing twice, it will turn out differently?

Thanks all for your insight and advice.