Argyll CMS

[Richard Lundberg]

Has any non geek ever been able to install this profiler/whatsit app without professional help? I've unpacked, but apparently not in the right place, and it needs something called dispcalgui which I also have. I have googled installing argyll and I get incomprehensible instructions that presume knowledge i don't have, and something called ZeroInstall which might be the answer to my problem, but it doesn't explicitly say so.
Apparently you need to be a command line whiz, but maybe not.

[ajohnw]

http://dispcalgui.hoech.net/#install

John
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[Richard Lundberg]

That link is for dispcalgui,which I already have. The link says that if you have Zeroinstall skip the first step. I have no idea what that means. I understand that dispcalgui is is a GUI for Argyll CMS. Fine. What I need to know is what does Zeroinstall do? There is no explanation. Does it somehow find Argyll, put it in the right place, and hook it all up? I can't understand the instructions for installing Argyll on Mac OS X without Zeroinstall, and not knowing what Zeroinstall does leaves me wondering what I have to do BEFORE using it.
I've done installations of other apps such as Krita in Ubuntu so I semi-understand packages. Maybe it would be way easier just to do the whole thing in Ubuntu in Fusion.

Edit: I installed Zeroinstall. It went through all the usual gyrations, asking which disk, progress bars, etc. But it isn't installed anywhere that I can see. It's not in Applications, it's not an extension to Safari. EasyFind says there are four icons, but no app.

[ajohnw]

I was suggesting the simple don't think route - you need dispcalgui to make calibration and profiling easier so forget Argyll and do what it says - install it. I can't really help on windows as I have only installed either on Linux.

What I suspect you will find is that either dispcalgui will install argyll for you or tell you what to do. If it complains there is a forum on it's site ask there and generally you will get an answer within 24hrs. He always answers quickly or some one else will.

My understanding of Mac's is that they have a shell similar to bash - command line thingy. You may need to use that for Argyll so if some one suggests this and things aren't clear just ask again.

This blog as I suspected suggests that dispcalgui install will install all of it for you

http://www.juliengille.com/en/blog/2...nd-dispcalgui/

As far as using the software goes that doesn't seem to be up to date. There should be a calibration window before the profiling. The monitor should be trimmed as close as possible to the target white point and luminosity before profiling using it's own controls. If you find yourself doing several profiles remember to add something to the end of the names dispcalgui comes up with so that you know which is which. The names it comes up with can also be changed. % this and that pick out things like monitor names and date etc. It should also install the profile for you and allow you to load others if needed.

If when you get to calibration and profiling you have any doubts post a screen shot of it's window,

Whoops should have said Mac but the same would apply.

John
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[Richard Lundberg]

Thanks for that link, I'll check it out. I'm beginning to think that the Zeroinstall installer put something isn the system folder that allows Terminal command line installations by using the URL of the application. That seems to be the intent although it is never clearly stated.
I have never before seen a situation like this where there are apps for apps and none of them explain what they are actually doing. The site for each one presumes that you know what the others are for. The Argyll explanation of installing on Mac OSX leaves me bewildered and Zeroinstall says it takes care of all that but offers no explanation of where it installs or what to do to use it.

[ajohnw]

The instructions for Argyll aren't that bad. Mac's probably have a file search so simply find the ones it mentions. Unpacking or moving the file to the /usr/bin would be where I would put it. Mac's are very similar to Linux - surprise surprise. /usr/bin will be off the base of the drive. On windows it would c:\usr\bin. On unix type systems there is no need for the drive letter, the first slash takes things back to the start of the drive that you happen to be on.

When you edit one of the files it mentions don't use vi, it a horrible thing. I can't comment on what the open instruction will do but the best way to modify the files is with a text editor or any editor that can load and save an ordinary text file.

As I suggested though - just run the dispcalgui installer and see what happens. It might look after all of this for you.

John
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[Richard Lundberg]

I went to the link and dispcalgui does not appear to be an installer for Argyll, it just provides a GUI to avoid using command line. Your comments about /usr/bin are helpful. Thanks.
I have appealed to the community in LuLa for aid. Someone in there will have done this, but probably geekily.

[ajohnw]

I would still run the dispcalgui installer and see what happens if I were you. I'm pretty sure it will do exactly what it says - guide you through the steps you need to take - all of them.

John
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[Richard Lundberg]

Zeroinstall does in fact enable a command line interface for installing packages. I haven't mastered it yet and hope to find an online resource. I did decipher how to see the man pages but they are not much help because each page is full of command line jargon,
Not sure where to find usr/bin yet. I have seen it when running WhatSize, so I could find it that way. I will try installing dispcalgui, hey, what could go wrong.
Edit: I have found a Zeroinstall user manual of sorts and will begin reading it. I have the page that shows how to install apps from a URL but I don't thoroughly understand it yet because of the intense eekness. It appears to be a pretty good solution for installing Linux-like packages on a Mac.

[ajohnw]

This might be of interest at some point

http://www.macdevcenter.com/pub/a/ma...2/24/bash.html

What can go wrong - very little really as it can always be installed again. Just play around not knowing what you are doing - probably wont work at all.

John
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[Richard Lundberg]

Well, it turns out that playing around not knowing what you're doing isn't that bad an idea.When I reread the "Installing on OS X" article again, it seemed way too complex, but I tried the first part. It said to unpack the tar in /usr/bin. Turns out Mac OSX won't let you. I had already unpacked the tar to the Desktop weeks ago, so I just moved the unpacked folder to Applications. Then I installed the dispcalgui.dmg, which gave me a window full of apps and aliases. I moved them to a folder I labelled dispcalgui, and moved that to Applications. When you launch dispcalgui, it asks you where Argyll is, so I told it that it was in Applications. DCG seemed to be happy with that and works fine. So. my performance anxiety was all for naught and the process was just about as straightforward as any other app install. Fear not, Argyll adventurers!

[ajohnw]

I thought you might get bogged down with executable rights which is probably why you couldn't directly unpack to /usr/bin.

All's well that ends well etc.

John
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[Richard Lundberg]

I agree, it turns out you can unpack in /usr/bin if you use a sudo, but that's again way too geeky. Command line is so 90s. Everything now should run on an iPhone.

[ajohnw]

The linux answer to avoiding the command line is to create a file browser version that runs in root mode. You will probably find that is possible by creating a new icon for it and setting run as other user in it's properties. Same with a text editor. Your bound to have one but I don't know what it's name is. You will also probably find that the text editor in user mode can browse system script files but wont allow you to change them. Saves messing things up by accident.

On the other hand the Ubuntu stable hijack root and only allow users to use sudo. I tried it once and spent an hour un sudo ing it and then found I still couldn't log on as root. If it's like that you may be able to create sudo applications where needed.

The console is useful for some things. Compiling source code for instance. The source will usually have a readme.txt that states exactly what needs to be typed. The compiler etc is needed not sure what that means on a mac.

The console runs bash. It's not my favourite shell but for people who do know how to use it can do all sorts of things very quickly with it. Not that many people would want to do what they do - often. My dislike comes from the fact that it's grown like topsy in many areas, ex university type stuff and I would rather use shells that have a limited number of commands that can be arranged to do the same things. There used to be one about that ran dartmouth basic, considered to be optimum minimal number of commands that will do all things that other similar languages can do. Trouble was it was called basic so pride got in it's way. Also more typing and intelligence. The typing aspect is why bash command names often don't really give a clear idea of what they can do.

John
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[Richard Lundberg]

I've done installations in Ubuntu that required command line, but there were almost always very clear instructions. I just think that GUI is the only way to gain acceptance for your wonder app.

[ajohnw]

If you looked at top end spectrometers you might find 2 prices for the same instrument. The dearer one still doesn't come with software as comprehensive as this. That's why a fair number of people go to the trouble of using it.

The fun part is calibration and profiling. It's not unusual for people to do that several times and with the best test patches to use it wont be done in a few mins. More like 30min.

I'm assuming the mac version does offer the calibration screen. It's worth getting that as exact as possible even if that means departing a bit from the precise colour temperature that is required. I've found that tftcentrals suggested contrast setting is pretty close and it's debatable if it's worth playing around with it. Brightness may need tweaking a little or what ever to get the screen luminosity you want.

I'd be interested to see the long report on your screen when you feel you have it correct. I found that file dump sites wont take html files but if you have Unbuntu you shouldn't have any problems printing it to a pdf.

John
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[ajohnw]

Forgot to mention that you can also calibrate your camera and printer with Argyll. A scanner is needed in the case of the printer. They give a source of precise test cards for both at a reasonable price some where on the Argyll site. The same source will provide cards with individual measurements but the costs go up. The normal ones are batch calibrated.

Command line but not to difficult to do. I don't think the dispaclgui man has any intention of adding a graphical interface for these.

Frankly I don't think they care if more users would use it if it all installed graphically. Installing the Argll part isn't difficult as you found anyway. The dispcalgui aspect on Linux at least is a conventional click it and install as are I suspect the other platforms.

John
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[Richard Lundberg]

There's an app for Win called ICC Color Camera Calibrator, CoCa for short I could run on Fusion, that has links to many different color test charts. I already have an IT-8 that I used in Vuescan to calibrate my printer for copy paper.
I need to get the i1 Display Pro if I'm going to get serious, because the Dell LUT tweaker demands it. Amazon had it at a steadily decreasing price which got down to 164 with rebate. I waited one day too long and the price shot back up to 249. No reason available. It's possible it's an improved version.
I don't fear command line. I sued DOS from ver 1.1 to 6 something, and I install things in Ubuntu from time to time. I just think that a viable app must not exhibit user hatred.

[ajohnw]

You can also LUT calibrate with DispCalGui. Select an XYZ LUT profile - quality high. The video card LUT will be used. If you select as swapped matrix to check that the profile is being used correctly you will find that Firefox doesn't handle it correctly. It doesn't check which colour is which, just assumes or maybe wont work with one at all.

i1 display may need to be bought off Dell to get the correct software for the monitor. Not sure but worth checking. Could be that the Argyll people will hack it at some point as there are bound to be requests. As it stands the software is locked to a particular colourimeter and you will probably find it just calibrates to a few colour patches as that's the best way to make things look good. It's a lot easier to meet the recognised spec's - which the reports actually show using this software.

Shame you have already bough a test card. The source that they suggest are very precise not that this matters really but...

I believe 3D LUT's have been added recently or enhanced. Not sure what these are about but have the impression it's a video thing.

John
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