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Thread: Printer Grief

  1. #1
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    Printer Grief

    Hi,

    I have been have getting really disappointing results printing some photos on my inkjet printer. The colors do not come close to reproducing colors that I see on the screen. In particular dark greens which tend to come out more brownish and the prints are generally too dark.
    I am using a Canon ip4300 printer and Illford Galerie Smooth Pearl paper and printing from CS3. My OS is Windows XP.

    I have:

    1. Profiled my monitor
    2. Compared the image on the profiled monitor to several other non-profiled monitors. All are reasonably close, which seems to indicate that the image I see on the monitor is "correct".
    3. Downloaded the generic printer profile for my paper/printer combination from the Illford site.
    4. Purchased a custom printer profile.

    For 3 and 4 I have printed with Photoshop Manages Colors and the right profile.
    I have also made sure that printer color management is turned off.

    The results from 3 were better (though not acceptable) than 4! In fact the custom printer profile was terrible.

    I have noticed that if I soft proof the target for the custom profile using the generic profile that I downloaded that many of the color squares for the target are out of gamut (especially in the greens) though the actual image I am trying to print is in gamut. Does that tell me something?

    Is there something else I should be trying?

    I am thinking of trying a custom profile from a different vendor.

    I would appreciate any help.

  2. #2
    Shadowman's Avatar
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    Re: Printer Grief

    Can you and do you use Adobe RGB color space when photographing your images? This setting will make it more compatible to CS3 for professional printing.
    Quote Originally Posted by wapiza View Post
    Hi,

    I have been have getting really disappointing results printing some photos on my inkjet printer. The colors do not come close to reproducing colors that I see on the screen. In particular dark greens which tend to come out more brownish and the prints are generally too dark.
    I am using a Canon ip4300 printer and Illford Galerie Smooth Pearl paper and printing from CS3. My OS is Windows XP.

    I have:

    1. Profiled my monitor
    2. Compared the image on the profiled monitor to several other non-profiled monitors. All are reasonably close, which seems to indicate that the image I see on the monitor is "correct".
    3. Downloaded the generic printer profile for my paper/printer combination from the Illford site.
    4. Purchased a custom printer profile.

    For 3 and 4 I have printed with Photoshop Manages Colors and the right profile.
    I have also made sure that printer color management is turned off.

    The results from 3 were better (though not acceptable) than 4! In fact the custom printer profile was terrible.

    I have noticed that if I soft proof the target for the custom profile using the generic profile that I downloaded that many of the color squares for the target are out of gamut (especially in the greens) though the actual image I am trying to print is in gamut. Does that tell me something?

    Is there something else I should be trying?

    I am thinking of trying a custom profile from a different vendor.

    I would appreciate any help.

  3. #3
    arith's Avatar
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    Re: Printer Grief

    I don't print much but would like to say mine always come out dark with much less definition than my screen, but I've only got a cheap printer to print out receipts ect. Try making the image a lot brighter for the printer, but people here really know what they are doing and will be able to give good advice. cheers

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    Re: Printer Grief

    Hi Wapiza,

    On the face of it, it looks like your doing everything right. Out of interest, what colourspace is the image in (sRGB, Adobe RGB etc)? What your getting sounds similar to what you get from an image in a large space like Prophoto being treated as a sRGB, but that shouldn't be the case if your printing directly from CS3.

    A couple of things to try ...

    Try converting an image to sRGB and then have it printed (with "no adjustments" at a local print facility) ... and ...

    Consider purchasing a standard 24 patch Macbeth (or whatever they're called these days) colour card -- plug in the LAB values for the patches into CS3 -- see how the screen colours compare -- print it -- see how the printed results compare.

    Also - is their any kind of printer diagnostic you can run to check for blocked jets etc?

  5. #5

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    Re: Printer Grief

    Is this new equipment or a fault which has occurred on a printer which was previously working OK? If the latter, my first thought was a blocked nozzle, as Colin suggested.

  6. #6
    hurkmez's Avatar
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    Re: Printer Grief

    Hi,

    i'm using same equipment. Canon IP4300 and macbook (cs3) and then i have same problem too.

    i find this link about printing:
    http://cpn.canon-europe.com/content/...management2.do

    my screen isn't calibrated and i think if screen isn't calibrated you can't see same color and contrast...

    but i want to test a difrent method. like that i print some specific color on my hand color cart (cmyk,pantone) and than i compare my print and color cart if it's same i must to calibrate my screen,

    i'll write my test result,

    Hakan,

  7. #7
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    Re: Printer Grief

    Thanks to those that answered.

    For those that asked I am using sRGB... though my camera does support Adobe.

    I understand that Adobe will provide a wider color space.... but in that particular case does it really matter? My printer cannot reproduce sRGB to my satisfaction. I am not sure that it will be able to handle Adobe any better.

    Shadowman wrote:
    Can you and do you use Adobe RGB color space when photographing your images? This setting will make it more compatible to CS3 for professional printing.
    Can you elaborate the link between Adobe RGS and CS3?

    I will try the block nozzle test.

    W

  8. #8
    Shadowman's Avatar
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    Re: Printer Grief

    Wapiza,

    the Adobe Color space function only matters if you are having your photographs printed professionally. Professional printers use either laser or dye-sub which transfers colors differently and with dye=sub the laydown is continuous, layed down in a dry or gas state, and also uses different color format (CMYO vs CMY for ink jet). You probably won't see the difference with an inkjet if you use Adobe Color Space.
    Quote Originally Posted by wapiza View Post
    Thanks to those that answered.

    For those that asked I am using sRGB... though my camera does support Adobe.

    I understand that Adobe will provide a wider color space.... but in that particular case does it really matter? My printer cannot reproduce sRGB to my satisfaction. I am not sure that it will be able to handle Adobe any better.

    Shadowman wrote:


    Can you elaborate the link between Adobe RGS and CS3?

    I will try the block nozzle test.

    W

  9. #9

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    Re: Printer Grief

    Just to elaborate on Shadowmans answer ...

    sRGB is (supposedly) close to the gamut that monitors produce (an additive colour process), but clips portions that subtractive colour process (CMYK) devices like printers may be able to reproduce. So if you shoot Adobe RGB - and then print it yourself on a CMYK device like your doing then - in theory - you may be able to reproduce more colours, although you won't be able to see them on your monitor.

    The "usual" trap is for people to save an image with an Adobe RGB profile (or ProPhoto Profile) - take the image to a photo printing shop (which usually only support sRGB*) - and then wonder why the images look under-saturated and flat.

    Sorry - I didn't mean to throw you off the scent with my colourspace question - it's just that IN THEORY what you're doing sounds correct, but in practice, you're not getting the correct result - so I was just trying to ask a few peripher questions (no pun intented) to try and uncover a few more clues.

    Having said all that though - at the end of the day - there ISN'T a one-to-one corelation between what you see on a monitor and what appears on a print as one is an additive process with typically a 6 stop (practical) dynamic range whilst the other is a subtractive process with a 4 stop dynamic range - with both using gamuts that have at least some mutually exclusive colours; so a degree of tweaking of the image to compensate is nearly always required.

    * Why they only support sRGB in this day and age is anyones guess

  10. #10
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    Re: Printer Grief

    Hi,

    You give usefull information about color management. And then when i search about color management on net i can find a lot information too.

    i try to use and test them. But i think all information only valid to same situation and equipment.

    and then we (or i) want to see print document appear same with monitor.

    yesterday i open new document on CS3 color space adobe RBG. i put 3 point on the document
    R255 B0 G0
    R0 B255 G0
    R0 B0 G255
    and i print it. my prints have very difrent color as my monitor. later i open cs3 color proof-->custom and set it Canon paper PR1 profile. and it's amazing i can see my print and monitor almost same color.

    but when i open a photo and print it same setting. and then look it same custom color proof settings i can't see same result. printing document very good a little dark. But when i printing set printer setting (light print) this time it isn't dark. But my monitor show very bad color with color proof-->custom-->canon paper PR1.

    same situation give difrent result :S i check my setting a few times. but it's correct and same.

    i think maybe my monitor can't show colors in print document and show poorly.


    My equipment:
    Printer Canon IP4300
    Macbook 13.3"

    Hakan,

  11. #11

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    Re: Printer Grief

    Quote Originally Posted by hurkmez View Post
    yesterday i open new document on CS3 color space adobe RBG. i put 3 point on the document
    R255 B0 G0
    R0 B255 G0
    R0 B0 G255
    and i print it. my prints have very difrent color as my monitor.
    This can be a very hard thing for a printer to print because it doesn't have red, green, or blue ink ... just the same as it's very hard for a monitor to display the likes of highly saturated cyans and magentas.

    You're not doing something strange like using the monitor profile or printer profile as a working profile are you?

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