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Thread: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

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    Moderator Dave Humphries's Avatar
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    Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    A Ring-necked Parakeet - I seem to be attracting quite a few of these to the garden this year with peanuts

    Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510
    Nikon P510 at 180mm: 1000mm (FFE), 1/160s, f/5.9, iso400, EC -0.66 (243_2105_DH_ed1)
    Hit Kbd F11 and click image to see at 1,200px 900px (recommended)

    Not everyone likes them, being non-native here, although now very well established.
    I have to say, they are very noisy blighters!

    This was shot from an open first floor bedroom window, while the subject was perched in a Magnolia tree, checking it was safe to feed.

    I am still learning how to get decent quality from my fairly recently acquired Nikon P510 - it only shoots jpg, but was a MUCH cheaper (and lighter) way of getting 1000mm Full Frame Equivalent (FFE) than a 750-800mm lens for my D5000.

    This is framed as shot, no cropping
    Levels adjusted (it was a bit under exposed)
    Cloned out some extra twigs on right and 'terminated' the one that was 'escaping' in the middle - hopefully so it doesn't take the eye out of frame
    Local Contrast Enhancement with USM (20%, 90px radius, 0 threshold) (helps with feather detail)
    Downsized from 4608 x 3456px to 1200 x 900px (helps with noise and percieved sharpness)
    Sharpened with USM (90%, 0.4px radius, 1 threshold)

    Hope that info. helps and I'd be interested in feedback (esp. on IQ; image quality).
    I am already thinking it is just a bit too tightly framed and I should have added a bit of canvas to get more space below bird and branch.

    Thanks,
    Last edited by Dave Humphries; 24th July 2012 at 08:50 PM.

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    Moderator Donald's Avatar
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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    A couple of things make this work for me, Dave.

    • The background harmonises with the colour and tone of the bird (at least to my colour-blind eyes it does!)
    • The line of the branch (top right towards bottom left) is perfectly repeated in the line of the bird from head to tip of tail. That contributes to the harmony and balance in the image. Imagine oif the brancg had been horizontal. It would have jarred.


    I think the quality is good. as well as studying the feathers on the bird, I looked at the bark and the lichen on the tree branches. The structure/texture in those is picked up well.

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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    I'm very impressed with the image quality considering that the ISO was 400.

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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    Nicely done Dave, I am right there with Donald.

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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    It looks like you are making excellent use of your new camera Dave! Yes, I think it needs a bit more space around the subject but for a 1000mm (FFE) lens at maximum reach the detail is very impressive.

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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    A few days ago posted a question whether i can use NikonP510 for bird photography.Very few supported my view.Now i have got my answer.This picture simply says that Bridge camera is no longer minnows .We can use bridge camera for bird photography as a low cost alternative to costly long zoom SLR lenses.Thanks Dave.

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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    Beautiful! I might have photoshopped the background to a different hue with the same color temperature as the bird to for contrast --maybe a blue version of the blue-green in his tail. His head kinda get's lost in the background at first glance.

    I'm a newbie, so take my thoughts as a grain of salt

    How do you move fast enough to catch a bird before it flys away? I'm amazed that you could get a candid shot of him without actually being on a quest for bird shots!

    ggt

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    Moderator Dave Humphries's Avatar
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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    Hi all, thanks for taking the time to comment, I read thm when posted, but didn't have time to reply, my apologies.

    Donald - thanks - but I think I overdid the sharpening just a touch for the Lichen though

    Helen - the downsizing from uncropped did the trick, if I had cropped it, I'd probably have needed to use Neat Image for noise reduction

    Paul - thanks

    Frank - thanks, yes, after posting this I did try extending the canvas by 20px and cloning over, but doing it on all four sides I got bored and gave up

    pinakibaidya - yes, in good light, with fairly static birds (e.g. perched on a branch or floating on water) it is fine, but the AF is completely useless for Birds in Flight
    (it makes me swear and cuss repeatedly)

    Gretchen oh, I was 'on the quest' - I regularly shoot the feeding birds from the bedroom window, I just hope the neighbours at the bottom of the garden don't see me one day and get the wrong idea

    Once again, thank you all,

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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    Dave,
    your picture was very good. I was very impressed with the picture quality of the P510.
    I like superzoom cameras, but I doubted whether they were suitable for photographing birds.
    You and Otavio showed me that it is possible to take good pictures of birds with superzoom cameras, if the light conditions are favorable.
    P.S.
    Please, I request that you respond to my thread "Request information on the Canon S100" (Digital Cameras & Equipments), started in July 15, 2012, because I am interested in buying a S100 for general picture and street photos.

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    Moderator Dave Humphries's Avatar
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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    Quote Originally Posted by Antony View Post
    I like superzoom cameras, but I doubted whether they were suitable for photographing birds.
    You and Otavio showed me that it is possible to take good pictures of birds with superzoom cameras, if the light conditions are favorable.
    Yes, I believe it is suitable, but as you say, the conditions need to be right (good light and focus, contrast or colour separation between bird and background), not much fine detail expected - and you can't crop as agressively as you would with RAW and a bigger lens.

    Quote Originally Posted by Antony View Post
    P.S.
    Please, I request that you respond to my thread "Request information on the Canon S100" (Digital Cameras & Equipments), started in July 15, 2012, because I am interested in buying a S100 for general picture and street photos.
    I have replied (and some)
    I missed it first time, sorry.
    Last edited by Dave Humphries; 6th August 2012 at 07:32 PM. Reason: improved

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    Panama Hat & Camera's Avatar
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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    Dave,
    Which minimum focal length (cropping the image, of course) would be required in a real lens for the Nikon D5000 for taking a photo of the same quality and image size that the picture you took of the parakeet with the Nikon P510? Which would be the maximum overture (minimum F-number) of this lens?
    Antonio.

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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    On a non photography note it's interesting that you see a lot of these, my girlfriend's parents live near windsor and they regularly have 3 of them at their birdfeeder, they're trying to work out how to discourage them.

    I'm quite impressed at being able to shoot at 160th at 1000mm, makes me think I'm possibly over keen to try and double the FFE focal length in shutter speed.

    I think I might have to take a trip myself as it's a pretty magnificent garden bird (just a shame my 70-300mm lens's autofocus is broken)

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    Moderator Dave Humphries's Avatar
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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    Quote Originally Posted by Antony View Post
    Dave,
    Which minimum focal length (cropping the image, of course) would be required in a real lens for the Nikon D5000 for taking a photo of the same quality and image size that the picture you took of the parakeet with the Nikon P510? Which would be the maximum aperture (minimum F-number) of this lens?
    Antonio.
    Hi Antonio,

    This image wasn't cropped at all, so all we need apply is the DX crop factor of 1.5.

    It was shot at 1000mm FFE, so that's 1000/1.5 = 666mm. Of course, no-one makes one of those, so the nearest size would be 600mm (giving 900mm FFE) and crop a bit. That's likely to be a prime, so it becomes a lot less versatile than a zoom and it'll be much heavier.

    Regarding aperture, the Depth of Field I get here is also affected by the sensor crop factor, so f/5.9 x 5.6 (the P510 crop factor) gives f/32, but we also need to apply the D5000 crop factor of 1.5 to that, making f/22 in 'round' figures.

    At that aperture (f/22), diffraction would be evident and soften the image, now whether that would be as much as the small lens and jpg processing softens it is open for debate (or test if anyone has both).

    Of course, in reality, you couldn't shoot this at f/22 with a D5000 for the same DoF, you would have to use say, f/8 to get a sensible shutter speed and hope DoF is sufficient.

    It is worth saying that at such a low shutter speed as I used on this (1/160s), most shots (90%+) are spoiled by subject movement, even if the IS/VR keeps the background sharp by lessening camera shake. You have to shoot lots and hope you get lucky as the bird pauses movement to search for threats or assess where it is going to land next.

    You can see how all these factors make a case for a 320 Nikon P510 against the 7070 Nikon AF-S 600mm f/4 VR IF-ED Lens to fit the D5000! I spent less than that (7k) on a second hand car which I use every day!

    I can't compare the quality between the two I'm afraid.

    I have no doubt Auto Focus of the 600mm lens plus D5000 will work MUCH better than the Nikon P510 and may make birds in flight possible (no hope with P510 AF), however, the other problem I find with 1000mm FFE is actually finding the subject, I often need to zoom out, seee where it is (if say, perched in unfamiliar trees), then zoom in to take the shot - this wouldn't be possible with the prime telephoto that is the 600mm.

    Another image quality factor for say, landscape use, on even UK days at say 15-20 celsius, is heat haze; at 1000mm, a pleasing scene can be ruined by this - and that'll apply to either camera.

    If anyone is thinking of buying binoculars or a bird 'spotting scope', I reckon the Nikon P510 is equivalent to a "20x" pair of binos and you get a 16 MP camera thrown in, which makes the ones in spotting scopes look rather sad (e.g. 3 - 5 MP), although they do magnify even more (e.g. 15 - 45x).

    Cheers,
    Last edited by Dave Humphries; 18th August 2012 at 09:21 AM. Reason: Added a bit

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    Moderator Dave Humphries's Avatar
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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    Quote Originally Posted by RichB View Post
    On a non photography note it's interesting that you see a lot of these, my girlfriend's parents live near windsor and they regularly have 3 of them at their birdfeeder, they're trying to work out how to discourage them.

    I'm quite impressed at being able to shoot at 160th at 1000mm, makes me think I'm possibly over keen to try and double the FFE focal length in shutter speed.

    I think I might have to take a trip myself as it's a pretty magnificent garden bird (just a shame my 70-300mm lens's autofocus is broken)
    Hi Richard,

    When you're next up this way, see if you can divert to Bushey or Richmond Parks, both have huge nesting populations of these birds and you'll hear them incessantly. Earlier in the year (before April) is a good time to see them; no leaves on trees and they are looking for/using their nest holes high up in the trees.

    On shutter speed, I'll copy what I just wrote to Antonio;
    It is worth saying that at such a low shutter speed as I used on this (1/160s), most shots (90%+) are spoiled by subject movement, even if the IS/VR keeps the background sharp by lessening camera shake. You have to shoot lots and hope you get lucky as the bird pauses movement to search for threats or assess where it is going to land next.

    I have some respectable shots at 1/50s at 1000mm handheld, now that is just silly, but the P510 VR/IS is that good, although this is 'combined' with less resolution than you'd get with a DSLR, which probably hides some of the blur.

    Cheers,

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    Moderator Dave Humphries's Avatar
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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    I have been meaning to do a comparison under more strict criteria, but thought I'd try anyway.

    Here is a RAW shot taken with my Nikon 70-300mm at 300mm, then cropped to a magnification which I think, combined with crop factor, equates to 1000mm FFE like the Nikon P510's shot.

    Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510
    Nikon D5000 + Nikon 70-300mm VR: 300mm, 1/769s, f/8, iso400 cropped to 1000mm FFE (221-46112)
    Hit Kbd F11 and click image to see at 1200px 900px (recommended)

    I have some shots of the same birds (Grey Heron and Cormorant) taken side by side (hence same weather and location), so I'll try to process those sometime for a more valid comparison - this is just too different to judge.

    Cheers,

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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    Dave,
    thank you for your explanations.
    Antonio.

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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    Dave,
    It seems that you have guessed my thoughts and answered to me before I asked the question.
    Your new photo showed me that using a DSLR (sensor APS-C) with a 300 mm focal lenght (450mm FFE), I can take a photo of a bird and crop it to get an image with the same size that I would obtain if I used a superzoom (like P510).
    (However, the cut in the image of D5000 should have been a little more pronounced, because the image of the parakeet is a little lower in the last photo).
    I think I won't need to purchase a superzoom to replace my Kodak Z990 (which is slow and somewhat clumsy). It would much better purchase a Nikon D3100 (or D5100) and two zoom lenses (18-200mm and 70-300mm). The major disadvantage is the cost, which will be much greater than the purchase of a P510 or P500 or SX40. Or is there any advantage in buying a superzoom (aditionally to DSLR)? What do you think?
    Sincerely,
    Antonio.

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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Humphries View Post
    Hi Richard,

    When you're next up this way, see if you can divert to Bushey or Richmond Parks, both have huge nesting populations of these birds and you'll hear them incessantly. Earlier in the year (before April) is a good time to see them; no leaves on trees and they are looking for/using their nest holes high up in the trees.

    On shutter speed, I'll copy what I just wrote to Antonio;
    It is worth saying that at such a low shutter speed as I used on this (1/160s), most shots (90%+) are spoiled by subject movement, even if the IS/VR keeps the background sharp by lessening camera shake. You have to shoot lots and hope you get lucky as the bird pauses movement to search for threats or assess where it is going to land next.

    I have some respectable shots at 1/50s at 1000mm handheld, now that is just silly, but the P510 VR/IS is that good, although this is 'combined' with less resolution than you'd get with a DSLR, which probably hides some of the blur.

    Cheers,
    Interesting stuff, thanks for that. I will apply lots of shots soon.

  19. #19
    New Member Webbo51's Avatar
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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    I have recently started using a P510 and do find the AF difficult. I can occasionally "jag" one though!
    Attached Images Attached Images

  20. #20
    Panama Hat & Camera's Avatar
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    Re: Ring-necked Parakeet shot with P510

    Steve,
    I have a P510 and I concluded that AF is too slow for taking pictures of birds flying fast.
    Antonio.

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