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Thread: PSE is O.K. for editing but...

  1. #1
    rpcrowe's Avatar
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    PSE is O.K. for editing but...

    Actually. PSE-10 is a pretty nice editing program. I can actually do a few things quicker using PSE-10 than I could using Photoshop CS-5.

    However, I absolutely detest the organizer and much prefer organizing my images by myself without any automatic help from a software program.

    When using CS-5, I opened, edited and saved my images in the files of my own choosing and never lost an image. Now, I often have to search for images when using the PSE Organizer.

    Another thing that I abslutely hate is when I open any document or program that has images, PSE wants to import the images even when they are not my photos. This drives me crazy.

    Finally, when I open PSE-10, it often says that it is updating the organizer which takes an interminable amount of time.

    I have been saving images for years... I don't want my editing program to do this for me.

    Is there a way to disable the organizer and simple use PSE-10 simply as an editor and then save the images where, how and when I want to? Just like I did in CS-5.

    BTW: my copy of CS-5 was corrupted and that is why I switched to PSE-10.

    I will probably enroll in another community college course and buy an educational version of CS-6 when it comes out.

    I have Lightroom which I got in an educational version but have not played with it at all. I am afraid that the Lightroom organizer will give me the same problems as the PSE-10 Organizer does...
    Last edited by rpcrowe; 6th February 2012 at 01:04 AM.

  2. #2
    Poaceae's Avatar
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    Re: PSE is O.K. for editing but...

    I use Lightroom for 90% of my editing (NIK and CS5 for the rest). I only use the LR catalog when I download from card or bring images in for processing. The advantage of keeping it in the LR catalog is that all of the changes you make to an image are non destructive and remain with the image as long as it is in the LR catalog. But as I rarely reprocess images and as I like to be able to images around without having to go through Lightroom I use keep them outside the LR catalog.

  3. #3
    Glenn NK's Avatar
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    Re: PSE is O.K. for editing but...

    I probably use LR even more than John - about 95 percent or more. I'm still using PSE 8 for anything that LR can't handle which is getting to be less and less with each version of LR.

    I can fix spots such as dust bunnies or bug holes and blemishes on flowers quicker and easier in LR than in PSE.

    I will likely never bother with CS because of the cost, and I just don't feel like getting into layers (and if I must, PSE will work).

    As for other work, I use a focus stacking program (up until now CombineZ, but am very close to registering Zerene Stacker), and I've found that Enfuse/Enblend will do not too badly for situations where the total dynamic range won't fit onto my sensor.

    As for your question Richard, I haven't found LR to be intrusive in the manner you have described.

    Interestingly, LR doesn't save files in the "Save/Save As" sense; the sidecar files are automatically whenever you switch from one image to another. But, one can simply revert to the original by clicking "RESET" when in the Develop module; then you can start all over with the edits. The original RAW file is never touched - ever.

    Some users convert all their RAW files to DNG when they Import them into LR. Import means that LR knows where a file is and can access it.

    Glenn

  4. #4
    dje's Avatar
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    Re: PSE is O.K. for editing but...

    Richard

    I couldnd't agree more about Organiser. I don't like it and I don't use it. I have a desktop icon set up which points directly at the Photoshop Editor exe file rather than the Photoshop Elements exe file.

    ie to

    "C:\Program Files\Adobe\Photoshop Elements 9\PhotoshopElementsEditor.exe"

    rather than

    "C:\Program Files\Adobe\Elements 9 Organizer\Photoshop Elements 9.0.exe"

    These locations relate to my computer and PSE 9 rather than 10 but you should get the idea.

    By doing this, I can open up the editor directly.

    Let me know if you need further info.

    Dave

  5. #5

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    Re: PSE is O.K. for editing but...

    Afaik the splash screen asking you if you want to organise or edit shows only if you open the editor by clicking on the icon.
    If you open a raw file or you chose to open an image with PSE it will start right away in the edit mode.

    Just do it that way and no more nagging screens. Right click on a image and chose ' open with' then select PSE from the list.

  6. #6
    DanK's Avatar
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    Re: PSE is O.K. for editing but...

    Hey Richard,

    I bought my first SLR in 1968, so I'm right up there with you.

    I'm with John and Glenn--I do most of my work in Lightroom. It imports images by directory, but you can set it to ask you which to import after it reads the directory. You can then tag images any way you want in order to search for images without reference to the directory they are in.

    I stay in LR unless there is a reason not to. E.g., if I need to stack, I export from LR, stack in Zerene, and import the composite image back into LR. If I need masks, a luminance-only curve, or something else that LR lacks, I invoke CS5 as an external editor. That opens the image in Cs5 without exporting it from LR and automatically puts the new image in the LR catalog when you save it in CS5. I print, export for the web, and save for labs all from LR.

    Dan

  7. #7
    Moderator Dave Humphries's Avatar
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    Re: PSE is O.K. for editing but...

    Quote Originally Posted by dje View Post
    I couldn't agree more about Organiser. I don't like it and I don't use it. I have a desktop icon set up which points directly at the Photoshop Editor exe file rather than the Photoshop Elements exe file.

    ie to

    "C:\Program Files\Adobe\Photoshop Elements 9\PhotoshopElementsEditor.exe"

    rather than

    "C:\Program Files\Adobe\Elements 9 Organizer\Photoshop Elements 9.0.exe"

    These locations relate to my computer and PSE 9 rather than 10 but you should get the idea.

    By doing this, I can open up the editor directly.
    Hi Richard,

    I am with Dave 100% on this - I do this now with Elements 8 and did it before with PSE 6 when I had that (on another computer).

    On a 64 bit PC, you may find that the \Program Files\ bit of path is \Program Files [x86]\ because PSE8 (at least) is 32 bit.

    Cheers,

  8. #8

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    Re: PSE is O.K. for editing but...

    After fighting with the Elements Organizer for several years I bit the dust and converted to a Lightroom-PS5 workflow. I bought the software through a community college program so the cost wasn't too bad. Very glad I made the change. The LR organizer is much more stable than PSE. So far the only problem was caused by me when I turned off an external drive before it was finished. Even then the catalog was OK, just some missing photos. Another plus for LR is that it allows a lot more flexibility in hard drive organization. I use a top level catalog folder to hold everything including photo files so back up is easy. So is transferring back and forth between field notebook and home desktop.

    It took some learning to get used to PS5. I figured my experience with PSE would make it easy with just a few more features to learn. How wrong I was. The naming of some processes is completely different between the two programs. The main advantages of CS5 for me is being able to stay in 16 bit color mode, curves, and having LAB mode available.

    frank

  9. #9

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    Re: PSE is O.K. for editing but...

    Quote Originally Posted by OldFrank View Post
    After fighting with the Elements Organizer for several years I bit the dust and converted to a Lightroom-PS5 workflow. I bought the software through a community college program so the cost wasn't too bad. Very glad I made the change. The LR organizer is much more stable than PSE. So far the only problem was caused by me when I turned off an external drive before it was finished. Even then the catalog was OK, just some missing photos. Another plus for LR is that it allows a lot more flexibility in hard drive organization. I use a top level catalog folder to hold everything including photo files so back up is easy. So is transferring back and forth between field notebook and home desktop.

    It took some learning to get used to PS5. I figured my experience with PSE would make it easy with just a few more features to learn. How wrong I was. The naming of some processes is completely different between the two programs. The main advantages of CS5 for me is being able to stay in 16 bit color mode, curves, and having LAB mode available.

    frank
    Hi Frank,

    My standing advice with LR is "be careful about where the edits are stored" - if everything is stored in 1 database then that's one heck of an important database! I purchased and looked briefly at LR3, but for me, it didn't suit my workflow as well as Bridge did -- what I did feel FAR FAR FAR FAR more comfortable with though was having image edits stored in the same DNG file as the image data (which LR can do to - it just needs to be told to do it) - that way if there's ever an issue with a LR catalog / database one doesn't lose image edits (I know backups are the "answer" (in theory), but having been involved with IT all my working life, I also know that the theory and the practice don't always align very well (like how databases can be corrupt - but folks don't always know because they're not checking old data - and when they DO discover a corruption they find that they've already over-written the backup sets done before the corruption occured. Or they don't ever test backups - and discover (at the worst possible time) that their backups aren't as stable as they thought (I've personally had that one bite me in the bum big time)).

  10. #10
    arith's Avatar
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    Re: PSE is O.K. for editing but...

    Actually my pc is so slow I can go and make lunch before PSE10 launches. But here goes Richard, in the editor click Window, Welcome, Settings and mark 'Always launch PSE only' then unmark the Welcome screen somehow.

    Seems to work on mine.

  11. #11
    arith's Avatar
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    Re: PSE is O.K. for editing but...

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Humphries View Post
    Hi Richard,

    I am with Dave 100% on this - I do this now with Elements 8 and did it before with PSE 6 when I had that (on another computer).

    On a 64 bit PC, you may find that the \Program Files\ bit of path is \Program Files [x86]\ because PSE8 (at least) is 32 bit.

    Cheers,
    Just found out PSE10 is only 32 bit Dave. You can do 16 bit editing if you restrict yourself to just crop noise and sharpen, with plugins, ACR and some levels, but no layers.

  12. #12
    jprzybyla's Avatar
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    Re: PSE is O.K. for editing but...

    Richard,

    I have my Photoshop Elements 10 set up as Steve wrote to open only into the editor. At the top right of the Welcome screen under Settings you can choose to have it open only the editor. I have been trying/using Lightroom 4 beta ( a free trial download now until March) for editing and organizing my photographs. Much more user friendly and easier to use than the organizer in Photoshop Elements. It just takes a little getting use to and then is great. Most photos can be done without having to use Elements.

  13. #13

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    Re: PSE is O.K. for editing but...

    Quote Originally Posted by Colin Southern View Post
    Hi Frank,

    My standing advice with LR is "be careful about where the edits are stored" - if everything is stored in 1 database then that's one heck of an important database! I purchased and looked briefly at LR3, but for me, it didn't suit my workflow as well as Bridge did -- what I did feel FAR FAR FAR FAR more comfortable with though was having image edits stored in the same DNG file as the image data (which LR can do to - it just needs to be told to do it) - that way if there's ever an issue with a LR catalog / database one doesn't lose image edits (I know backups are the "answer" (in theory), but having been involved with IT all my working life, I also know that the theory and the practice don't always align very well (like how databases can be corrupt - but folks don't always know because they're not checking old data - and when they DO discover a corruption they find that they've already over-written the backup sets done before the corruption occured. Or they don't ever test backups - and discover (at the worst possible time) that their backups aren't as stable as they thought (I've personally had that one bite me in the bum big time)).

  14. #14

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    Re: PSE is O.K. for editing but...

    Quote Originally Posted by Colin Southern View Post
    Hi Frank,

    My standing advice with LR is "be careful about where the edits are stored" - if everything is stored in 1 database then that's one heck of an important database! I purchased and looked briefly at LR3, but for me, it didn't suit my workflow as well as Bridge did -- what I did feel FAR FAR FAR FAR more comfortable with though was having image edits stored in the same DNG file as the image data (which LR can do to - it just needs to be told to do it) - that way if there's ever an issue with a LR catalog / database one doesn't lose image edits (I know backups are the "answer" (in theory), but having been involved with IT all my working life, I also know that the theory and the practice don't always align very well (like how databases can be corrupt - but folks don't always know because they're not checking old data - and when they DO discover a corruption they find that they've already over-written the backup sets done before the corruption occured. Or they don't ever test backups - and discover (at the worst possible time) that their backups aren't as stable as they thought (I've personally had that one bite me in the bum big time)).
    Hi Colin,
    Ignore my extra response. I need to get used to the way the site works.

    I agree about backups. I do a complete system image backup on the desktop anytime I've done anything significant. That backup not only restores the data, but also the operating system and software. Even with a complete crash I can be up and going again in about 30 minutes. I'm a programmer as well and have had plenty of experience with bring my system to it's knees with a software bug. ( I don't program in the photography machine though). In addition to the main backup I update an external eSATA drive as well. When I go on the road I dump the latest catalogs into the notebook to take with me. When I return home is when it gets tricky especially if I get busy for a few days. I need to remember what I did on the road and which files are the ones I want. Usually, though I don't do any serious editing on the notebook other than a temporary tweek for a slide show.

    frank

  15. #15
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    Re: PSE is O.K. for editing but...

    Quote Originally Posted by rpcrowe View Post
    Actually. PSE-10 is a pretty nice editing program.

    However, I absolutely detest the organizer and much prefer organizing my images by myself without any automatic help from a software program.
    Me too. I had PSE7 and made the bad mistake of opening the Organizer just once and, golly, what an intrusive piece of junk it was! And, once used, it was always there in the background slowing everything to a snail's pace. It got so bad that I bought a PSE6 CD on eBay and started over. It's Organizer has never been touched and PSE6 does everything I need of it.

    Sometimes I think that keeping up with the latest of anything is a mug's game and my music-room Macintosh, still running System 9.0 agrees with that and so do both of our PC's - firmly stuck on XP Pro :-)

    Ted

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