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Thread: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

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    DavidLapin's Avatar
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    Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    I'm new to photography but want a camera that I can grow with. Will use it mainly for shots of faces taken from a distance, nature and wildlife. I'm intrigued by light, it's textures and how it falls on different surfaces at different times of day. Will need to invest in a few really good lenses too. But any recommendations for the camera? Am I looking at the right models (any of these will work with
    my budget) and if so which should I go for? I an concerned the Sony doesnt have Live View (why ever not?) Appreciate your help a lot.

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    Moderator Dave Humphries's Avatar
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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    Hi David,

    Welcome to the CiC forums from me.

    I'm not familiar with the Sony models, but the Nikon D7000 is probably a couple of levels above the Canon Rebel, which makes me wonder about your budget? Both what you were thinking for the camera body, and a total for lenses, plus lots of stuff you may not have considered; even down to a Post Processing programme for your computer.

    Could you Edit your Profile and give us a Location please?
    It helps us to advise you in your currency and national stores, etc.

    It may be of help to know if this will be merely a hobby, or potentially something more?

    For widest choice of lenses, I could order the list of manufacturers for you as: Canon (most) to Sony (least) with Nikon in the middle, but beyond that, a camera body from any those manufacturers will be sufficient - how much you spend depends on other things, mainly your total budget available (unfortunately).

    Cheers,

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    DavidLapin's Avatar
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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    Thank you so much for your prompt response. This site/forum is simply amazing in its volume and accessibility of information. This won't become more than a hobby I don't think, but for me it will hopefully become an important vehicle of artistic expression and I'm quite a perfectionist so would be irritated if I was not getting great quality because I skimped on the investment. On the other hand, although I want to be able to control as much as possible there is no point in features I'll never use or come out beyond my calabity. I will take some courses and training. I'm in S Arizona for a couple of months and theist and beauty at this time if year is breathtaking. The budget I'm looking at for equipment is $2000-$3500. Any guidance on how best to allocate it would be wonderful.

    I'm thinking of a good macro and zoom (f/2.8 at least 70-200mm, say) to start. Probably need some shake reduction techhnogy.

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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    Hi David,

    Being a Canon man, I can't comment on the Nikon and Sony models, but my standard advice is - personally - having owned a Canon xxxD range camera - I'd avoid buying at that end of the market, and suggest looking at the xxD range as a starting point (eg 60D). The entry level models don't have a Quick Control Dial on the back, so everything is accomplised with buttons, which isn't very efficiant compared to a QCD. There are also other differences in terms of constructions quality / shutter life / weather sealing etc.

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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    Thanks for that advice Colin. Canon doesn't have a 70D yet, does it?



    Quote Originally Posted by Colin Southern View Post
    Hi David,

    Being a Canon man, I can't comment on the Nikon and Sony models, but my standard advice is - personally - having owned a Canon xxxD range camera - I'd avoid buying at that end of the market, and suggest looking at the xxD range as a starting point (eg 60D). The entry level models don't have a Quick Control Dial on the back, so everything is accomplised with buttons, which isn't very efficiant compared to a QCD. There are also other differences in terms of constructions quality / shutter life / weather sealing etc.

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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidLapin View Post
    Thanks for that advice Colin. Canon doesn't have a 70D yet, does it?
    You could call them and ask

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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    Pop. Photography tagged the Canon T3i as a Best Product of 2011 - seem to recall the Sony A77 as camera of the year (about the same price range with room left in your budget for all the other stuff you'll need) - don't own either, so for what it's worth.

    May want to check out DXO labs comparing the various sensors, etc... Very, very interesting...Good luck!

    Correction: Sony A55 was the 2010 Pop. Photo. Cam of the year, don't see the A77 with the same distinction (the A77 did make the best of 2011 list however). A77's are hard to find due to the flooding. Canon also has a plant in Thailand, not sure if t3i inventory will be impacted / if there's more demand than supply on that one.
    Last edited by PhotoRob; 28th November 2011 at 12:48 AM.

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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    Edit - Note - the a77 I definitely can't speak for.

    Hi David,

    If you're a hobbyist with perfectionist tendencies, I think you should attempt answering some questions along the lines that Mr. Humphries is asking. It may save you some time/money. I learned that paying for the more expensive camera or the newest technology may not give you the results that you want for specific applications.

    my first cameras were the Sony a33 and the a55 during the debut of the SLT technology. One thing that I noticed about these new Translucent lens techs is that they were extremely pleasant in the best lit circumstances but in less than superb lighting I wasn't impressed. They have very high ISO ranges capable of making the best of the poorest lit situations but the overall quality made me want to pout when comparing it to SLRs of other brands in the same price range.

    The best selling points are: it's versatility (photos to videos), action handling, the auto-focusing during video is just phenomenal, and the features (such as built in GPS) are endless... BUT I didn't want a camera for the extra features. I wanted it for results. At first I was happy but over time, as I grew, I was indifferent.

    in my limited honest opinion) these cameras take better quality videos than they do pictures in the following based on the following: I haven't seen a single picture taken with the a55 or a65 that hadn't been bested by another camera in its price range.

    To be fair Sony has significantly improved on the tech with the latest models but I've found the Nikon D5100 to be exemplary at my level.

    But most importantly, see for yourself. There's no wrong answer, only personal preferences. Go to Flickr and do a search for the camera of choice under Groups. Comapre.

    With all of that gibberish being said, it's my personal opinion as a consumer, that I would go with a more proven/established brand or Sony's own SLR series before going with a Sony SLT camera just yet.
    Last edited by Mario Xavier; 28th November 2011 at 12:50 AM.

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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    General advice I've seen many times, yet very relevant, is to visit a store with a good selection of the cameras you're considering and spend some time handling the various cameras under consideration, and others you may not have thought of. One or the other may just feel better in your hands, or have controls, menu layout etc that is more intuitive to you personally. In current dslr offerings I don't believe there is a right or wrong answer.

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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    Thanks to all for your help. I'll HO and spend some time at Tempa Camera in Phoenix AZ tomorrow and tell you what transpires! Now some wisdom on the most important and best lenses to start with!

    Assuming i go the Canon route, I guess I need a good macro and a good,fast zoom of about 70-200mm. Any advice?

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    DavidLapin's Avatar
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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    Gosh, Dave. Spectacular pictures. Each one of them.

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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidLapin View Post
    Assuming i go the Canon route, I guess I need a good macro and a good,fast zoom of about 70-200mm. Any advice?
    Hi David,

    Depending on budget and preference, Canon make a number of 70-200mm lenses. Current top of the line is the EF70-200mm F2.8L IS USM II, with the EF70-200mm F4.0L IS USM also being a very popular lens (known for it's sharpness, and lighter weight). One potentially important differentiation is that with the F4 version, you'll lose AF ability when using a 2.0x teleconverter.

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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    I totally agree with Colin regarding preferring the mid-level Canon bodies over the Rebel line for all the reasons he mentioned.

    Additionally, I would elect to buy the body only, rather than a body with an 18-55mm, 18-135mm or 18-200mm lens.

    I would opt for the best mid-range zoom lens I could afford. IMO, the top of the Canon food chain for 1.6x crop cameras is the 17-55mm f/2.8 IS lens. The is only drawback to this lens is that it is expensive. An adequate choice at a lower price range would be the 17-50mm f/2.8 Tamron (either VC or non-VC). VC is Tamron's designation for camera shake control which Canon designates as Image Stabilization (IS) and, while not absolutely necessary on a lens of this focal length; it is quite handy. Along with the constant f/2.8 aperture, IS makes the 17-55mm f/2.8 IS lens into a viable low light glass.

    The 70-200mm f/2.8L IS Mkii lens is a wonderful lens in almost every respect except that it is considerably heavier than the 70-200mm f/4L IS lens. Unless you need the f/2.8 aperture, you may be better served with the f/4L IS lens at about 2/3 the weight and about half the price. Either of these lenses will produce exceptional image quality.

    The best USA prices will normally be found at either Adorama or B&H in New York City. Most often the shipping will be free and you won't be charged the California State Sales Tax. Prices from both these reputable vendors are usually far better than local brick and mortar stores. Don't be suckered into ordering from a vendor who quotes a price considerably lower than B&H or Adorama bacause this will normally be a rip-off or bait and switch artist. Also don't get suckered into buying a kit that includes: filters, tripod, flash and cleaning gear becase usually these extras are pure junk.

    Try to include a Canon flash with your order. The 580EXii is the best but, the 430EXii is very adequate and is less expensive and a bit smaller. I use my flashes for outdoor fill and indoors by bouncing with a diffuser/reflector. If price is becoming an obstacle to adding a flash, consider a used 580EX or 430EX...

    I have had good luck with buying Canon refurbished cameras. I purchased my 30D, 0D and 7D as refurbs and the prices were great. I got my 7D from Canon's Loyalty Program but, I don't think that the Loyalty program has 7D cameras anymore. However the Canon Website has 60D and 7D refurbs....
    Last edited by rpcrowe; 28th November 2011 at 06:00 AM.

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    Moderator Dave Humphries's Avatar
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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidLapin View Post
    Gosh, Dave. Spectacular pictures. Each one of them.
    If you mean mine (surely not), why thank you - but you should see Colin's

    The biggest investment needed is time and money coming a close second

    Either of those can be hard to find depending on our circumstances.

    For widest lens choice in Nikon, go D7000 rather than D5100, unless you really want the flippy screen (I did and I do use it, but I hate the restricted lens choice).

    Or Canon, of course.

    Cheers,

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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    I was talking about yours! I'll check Collin's too, thanks! Also for your generous advice.

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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    I would guess that most people on the forum are in the Canikon camp. Few have cross camp experience (I don't beyond borrowing on a few occasions).

    As technology progresses, sensor and lenses are better than yesteryears. Yet many people made many great pics in years gone past. One recent comment was that the greats of today made their name using the equipment of yesteryear.

    If the main interest in in photography and not impressing people, get a second hand camera, learn the skills. Find out what features you want, then make the big decision. There wil always be some trade offs, such as good ISO or fast frame rate.

    Composition and content are way more important. And you can do that using a camera with 3-4 mega pixels.

    Here are my own thought processes with respect to changing camera. Hope this helps. (Main thing is what images do you want to take, and then take it from there).

    I currently shoot with Sony A350 plus various lenses. Have also used Canon 7D and am thinking of upgrading within the next 6 months. Whether I change brands or not is a decision I am still working on, but all the reviews of the Sony A77 are excellent, waiting to see what the canikon response is.
    Do I NEED such a change? A definite NO. Would it make life easier? Yes.
    (I want to be able to take action shots in low light venues - as such I reckon the right MOMENT is more important than slightly better ISO performance. Software can improve that and software will improve in the future.

    Film days, 800 ASA (now ISO for me) was the effective limit (with acceptable - for then- grain). So 3200 ISO with minimal noise seems pretty good to me (7D is good, seems A77 is pretty close, but not quite as good, but acceptable). But 12 frames per second (Sony A77) is currently the top performer, making it a strong point in Sony's favour.

    Other nice stuff would be to be able to shoot tethered, continuous AF, touch screen (for choosing focal point). I'm sure there's other stuff (like the lyttro function), but doesn't come to mind right now.

    Graham

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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    If one assumes that the professional photographers know what they are doing, then one would likely pick one of the two brands that most of them by far use: Canon or Nikon.

    One thing for sure with these two brands - it's particularly easy to find lenses of other makes (Tokina, Tamron, Sigma, Zeiss).

    Glenn

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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    Quote Originally Posted by Glenn NK View Post
    If one assumes that the professional photographers know what they are doing, then one would likely pick one of the two brands that most of them by far use: Canon or Nikon.

    Glenn
    Hhhmm. Right by majority? Interesting argumentative position (even based on an assumption, which makes it an even weaker position). Or is this an example of sarcasm/sardonism looking like a real comment? Shouldn't a smiley face be used to distinguish between the two? Unsure about etiquette here.
    Graham

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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    Quote Originally Posted by GrahamH View Post
    Hhhmm. Right by majority? Interesting argumentative position (even based on an assumption, which makes it an even weaker position). Or is this an example of sarcasm/sardonism looking like a real comment? Shouldn't a smiley face be used to distinguish between the two? Unsure about etiquette here.
    Graham
    I took Glenn's comment at face value, and can appreciate where he's coming from. In my mind, it's a bit like buying an exotic car -v- a car from a mainstream manufacturer; ...

    - When you have a problem, there isn't as much collective wisdom to help you solve it

    - If you need a part, it's less likely that you'll be able to source spares locally

    - There may well be fewer accessories available for it

    - If there isn't a critical mass there's no guarantee that the model may even survive.

    Relating that to cameras ...

    - The likes of Canon and Nikon probably have a bigger range of lenses (both new and in 2nd hand markets)

    - There's more likely to be a service centre locally, with more spares "floating about in the system"

    - They're more likely to have accessories like flashes

    - People are more likely to be able to help with model-specific problems

    None of these reasons reflect on the quality of the camera or the quality of the images that it's capable of producing, but I do agree that they're factors to be considered in the purchase (I for one wouldn't buy anything other than a Canon or Nikon).

    Probably no "right or wrong" here -- just the way I feel about it.

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    Re: Choice: Canon Rebel, Nikon D 7000 or Sony 65 or 77

    I'm certaiinly not in Colin's or Richard's class, but I would just say that I have a D5000, and the limitations on my photography have absolutely nothing to do with equipment.

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